by Imam Sheharyar Shaikh
I do not believe that one should boycott anyone from holding a dialogue. One always learns something from an exchange, no matter how abhorrent or deviant their beliefs may be from one’s vantage point. One of the few exceptions I make is in the case of the lay Muslim’s engagement with the Ahmedi (Qadiani) missionaries and proselytizers. I list this due to the risk of losing one’s iman, thereby destroying one’s eternity as a result of such interactions if one isn’t fully cognizant of the opposing agenda. The mainstream Muslim boycott of the Ahmediyya Jamaat is in the best interest of the Muslims because of its deceptiveness and trickery in getting a lay Muslim to agree to certain points favourable to them in a discussion and its need for Muslims to attend their community events and programs in order to gain legitimacy in the eyes of the wider audience.
At any major Ahmedi event held in western countries, the overwhelming majority of Ahmedi attendees hail from Pakistan with Sunni Punjabi roots. The Ahmedi missionaries have made deep inroads in convincing the lay Sunni Punjabi Muslims, beyond others, of their version of Islam. Sure, a token Arab or a white Canadian may be seen meandering about in the corner, but it does not change the fact that the Pakistani Punjabis at home or abroad continue to fill their organizational rank and file. If the Ahmedi missionaries subject the Pakistani Muslims of small towns and villages to a “pir”-like persona of Ghulam Ahmed, they present a overly pacifist, rational, “science-friendly” Islam to the urban middle class Pakistanis and young professional Muslims overseas. The latter category, often cut off from their religious support and family system, become easy prey.
One thing not brought readily to the table are Mirza Ghulam Ahmed’s bizarre visions, his 20-year obsession with a 14 year old girl, Muhammadi Begam, his absurd religious interpretations, his claims of being 202 historical/honoured figures of other nations (male and female), his use of foul language toward his opponents, vulgarity in his writings, abnormal quirks of behaviour and his unfulfilled prophecies which he presented as evidence of his truth. Of the 86 books Mirza wrote in his lifetime (most of which are rubbish and can be readily read at www.alislam.org) the Muslims are usually presented two works: Mirza’s The Philosophy of the Teachings of Islam and Revelation and Rationality, Knowledge and Truth penned by his grandson, Tahir Ahmed (along with a team of helpers and translators).
The Ahmedi missionaries frame the discourse by limiting the discussion to the present status of Jesus – whom the mainstream Muslims believe to have ascended physically into heaven by divine miracle. Whether Mirza Ghulam Ahmed fits the profile of a divinely sent prophet, let alone Jesus (peace be on him), is largely neglected. But herein lies the test. Even if the world accepts Mirza’s half-baked theory of Jesus being taken off the cross, carried to India to live a happily married life with kids and eventually buried there at a ripe age of 120, it still needs to be proven how Mirza the claimant qualifies to be Jesus upon his return. Mirza certainly did not “break the Cross” if that means Christianity’s final annihilation – much as their cult claims. He certainly did not “end all wars”, religious or secular; WWI broke out a few years after his death.
One thing the Ahmediyya Jamaat never reveals on its own is the official status of the 1.5 billion Muslims from its point of view. Whereas they express much furor over being ostracised from the mainstream Muslim community, they hide the fact that it is their leaders who declared the mainstream Muslims asinfidels for rejecting Mirza Ghulam Ahmed (May Allah deal with him) as a prophet.
Mirza Ghulam Ahmed unequivocally called his non-followers:
“non-Muslims” (tazkira-e majmu’a-e ilhamat, pg. 600),
“complete kafir(s)” (infidels) (Kalimatul-fasl, p. 110)
“bastards” (walad ul-haram) (Anwar ul-Islam, pg. 30, RK vol. 9, pg. 31)
“children of whores” (dhuriyyat ul-baghayaa) (A’ina-e Kamalat-e Islam, pg 547-548, RK vol. 5, pg. 547-548)
“swines… and their women have become worse than bitches” (Najm ul-Huda, pg. 53, RK vol. 14, pg. 53)
So much for the “Love for all, hatred for none” slogan.
If there was ever a hope of turning to true Islam, Ghulam Ahmed’s son and a spiritual authority of the Ahmedis made clear that “(Ghulam Ahmed) has instructed us in detail that we differ with (the rest of the Muslims) in each and every thing (in Islam).” (Khutba-e Mirza Mahmud, al-Fazl, v.19, pg. 13). Moreover, he called it a “fard” (religious obligation) to consider all Muslims as “infidels” (Anwar-e Khilafat, 70). This even includes their “six month old babies” (Paygham-e Sulh, vol. 24, No. 49, August 3, 1936). Mahmud Ahmed went on to declare that those Muslims who have not given allegiance to Ghulam Ahmed are “infidels (kafirs) and out of the pale of Islam, even if they have not heard the very name of Maseeh Ma’ud (i.e. Mirza Ghulam Ahmed)” (Aina-e Sadaqat, pg. 35).
Now comes the point of how to deal with the Ahmediyya Jamaat, especially in the West. The overall best policy for the Muslims is to not deal with them at all, unless strictly for da’wah conducted by those who are acquainted with this cult’s vile agenda. It neither is, nor ever will be inshaAllah a serious threat to the global Muslim community. Our organization [North American Muslim Foundation] was approached many times to hold debates with them, and let it be known that we are always ready to hold a debate so long as it is public. With reference to the upcoming conference on the Prophet (s) to occur at the Roy Thompson Hall in Toronto on Tuesday, Nov 20, 2012, (for which we have so far received 4 invitation cards, 2 email invitations, a letter by mail and personal invites), I strongly advise the Muslims not to attend it. The purpose behind the event is to to attract the naïve Muslims to their ground for possible conversions by posing themselves as the foremost “defenders” of the Prophet’s honour. Secondly, it is to present themselves as peace-loving Muslims to the Canadians so as to win their sympathies and support.
Of course had they cared for the Prophet’s honour they would have rejected Ghulam Ahmed who claimed equality with or superiority over the Prophet (s) in the following words:
“..I am Muhammad (pbuh)” (tatimma-e Haqiqat ul-Wahi, pg. 521)
“I have been declared the very being (وجود) of Muhammad (Ek Ghalti ka Izala, pg. 10)
“Whosoever differentiates between me and Mustafa (s) has neither seen me – nor recognized me” (Khutba ilhamiyah, pg. 171)
And no, he is not “Muhammad (pbuh)” who is greater in glory than ever before in the form of Mirza Ghulam Ahmed (آگے سے بڑھکر ہيں اپنی شان مي ) (Badr Qadyan, 25 October, 1906, pg. 14).
How shameful it is that the Acting Consul General of Pakistan in Toronto, Imran Ali, has emailed all Pakistani-Canadians “requesting” them to make “the (Ahmedi) event a success” – this too from his official capacity! Subhaanallah, to my knowledge the Consul General Imran Ali has never officially promoted any mainstream Muslim event, let alone for a cult that heavily relies on obtaining immigration visas to Canada based on false claims and smearing Pakistan’s image. I have heard the Ahmediyya leadership vilify Pakistan before non-Muslim attendees during their Ahmediyya conference at University of Waterloo. What I have not heard is their use of “Zindabad”(long live) for Pakistan at their events as they routinely do for others.
And here is the Consul General of Pakistan Imran Ali, so concerned to promote an Ahmediyya event that he even asks us to “invite fellow Canadians” to it. I can just see the Ahmediyya leadership ‘high fiving’ each other for being able to so easily exploit such a gullible and incompetent diplomat; a cult he called “Muslim” in the email – perhaps not knowing or caring that the Ahmediyya Jamaat has a non-Muslim status in the constitution of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan which he represents.
Article 260 of the Constitution of Pakistan states:
A person who does not believe in the absolute and unequal finality of the Prophethood of Muhammad (peace be upon him), the last of the Prophets or claims to be a prophet in any sense of the word or of any description whatsoever, after Muhammad (peace be upon him), or recognize such a claimant as a prophet or a religious reformer, is not a Muslim for the purposes of the Constitutional Law.
The Application for Pakistani passport contains the following declaration:
DECLARATION (FOR MUSLIMS ONLY)
I do not recognize any person who claims to be a prophet in any sense of the word or of any description what so ever after Muhammad (peace be upon him) or recognize such a claimant as prophet or religious reformer as a Muslim. I consider Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani to be an imposter nabi and also consider his followers, whether belonging to the Lahori or Qadiani group to be non Muslims.
Please write to Imran Ali Chaudhary expressing your disappointment at imranali@pakmission.ca or call him at 647-821-7166.
You need to remind Imran Ali albeit with respect that his responsibility as Consul General is to improve consular services of Pakistan in Toronto, for which he is paid for by the taxpayers, and certainly not to promote Ahmediyya events in his official capacity. Jazakallah khayr.
Categories: Ahmadiyya, MDI Canada
The Muslim Debate Initiative 
Why prevent Muslims from engaging with them? Why cannot you educate the Muslims enough to deal with them. How will a Muslim loose the Eemaan if he knows Islam properly and if he does not know if properly what kind of Eemaan does he have?
Imam Sheharyar is currently a external invidividual to MDI, and does not represent us. However, please represent his article correctly, here is what he said:
‘The overall best policy for the Muslims is to not deal with them at all, unless strictly for da’wah conducted by those who are acquainted with this cult’s vile agenda. It neither is, nor ever will be inshaAllah a serious threat to the global Muslim community. Our organization [North American Muslim Foundation] was approached many times to hold debates with them, and let it be known that we are always ready to hold a debate so long as it is public. ‘
The article does not advocate boycotting debates with Ahmadis, in fact, it would welcome them! Unfortunately it has been our experience that Ahmadis are notoriously difficult to appear on a public debate platform (as far as our UK experience is concerned).
I hope this has clarified the matter for you.
i think it’s time MDI had a debate with an Ahmadi.
How could one debate Ahamdi if they don’t want to debate.
I have met many Ahamdi and had some discussions with them (one-one debate). They usually are far from Islam except for huge respect for their “Khalifas”…..if you ask them for proof, they give you stuff in urdu; people who are raised here are typically worse in following Islam themselves; relax on everything.
Their so called “scholars” are fools…circular reasoning where they refer to their own text and hadiths to prove that they are right. If you point out to them problems with Mira’s claims..they say….dont think of it as literal…..each one of them have different and weak apologies (made on the spot).
I say, they are absolutely waste of time…..lets keep focus on Atheists and to some extent Christians (most of them are really Agnostic at heart).
Assalamualaikum,
Can you kindly forward me a copy of or guide me towards the content of the email sent by the Consulate General. I am just curious about what exactly this entailed.
Thanks. If that’s not accessible, It’ll be great If you can guide me to Imam Sheharyar Sheikh’s email address.
jazakAllah Khayr.
wa salam,
Saad
I am a Muslim who is attached to the Ahmadiyya jama’at. I do not know about the official policy of the jama’at with regards to debating other Muslims, but I personally have found it quite a pointless exercise because usually the non-Ahmadi Imams I have discussed with have usually been very aggressive and once my life was even threatened by one such imam. Debates are fine if they are done in a climate of respect with a willingness to actually discuss beliefs rather than only throwing around insults; such debate serves no purpose but creates further distrust, anger and hatred, which is not the way of a Muslim. If that is what always happens when Ahmadi’s debate other Muslims, then I think it is the right policy to adopt to not engage in such debates.
Also there is no basis from the Qur’an, Sunnah or Hadith to refer to Ahmadi’s as non-Muslims. That seems very much like an innovation from the practice of Rasoollullah (saw). If a person believes in Allah and the Prophet Muhammad (saw) then he is a Muslim regardless of what any body of ulema say, nobody has the authority to “throw” others out of Islam. Only Allah has such authority. You may disagree with a person’s beliefs but to say somebody is not a Muslim is totally incorrect, since the Holy Prophet of Islam (saw) even accepted the known Munafiqeen to be called Muslims, though their disbelief was well known. The Prophet (saw) even offered the funeral prayer of the Chief of the Hypocrites of Medina. So my humble advice to you is to follow the practice of the Prophet (saw) and not adopt a policy of careless Takfir…perhaps Allah may apply it to those who do so.
See here we go again….this is Jamaa’ts main line…….”Mullahs are agressive, idiots etc”….I have listened to your tv programs….this is all you guys do….you create these virtual “Mullahs” who fit every stereotype and the narrative Jamaa’t feels is the case and the lectures are on bashing these imaginary “Mullahs”…and how Ahamadis are better than them since they are sooooo peace loving. They use fallacy of relevance and by proving these virtual Mullah wrong, they feel they must be right!
I agree there are crazy indo/pak “Mullahs” out there..but all of them seem to meet up with Ahamdis and they can’t get to meet any reasonable or knowledge scholar from Sunni. They just can’t find them.
Ahamdi’s throw themselves out of Islam when they have other Nabis beside the last messenger and Nabi.
Crazy interruption (1st become middle and middle become end) of a fabricated hadith about the eclipse can never make a sane person accept the falsehood. You know what I am talking about….!!
fallacy of relevance and straw-man fallacy combined actually*
mirza ghulam qadiani alleged that he is mentioned in the Quran;
“If Quran did not give me the name of Ibn-e-Mariam, then I am a liar”. [a gift of an-nadwah page 19]
also mirza ghulam alleged that qadian is mentioned in the Quran [tadhkira page 94 and 95]
so obviously the imposter mirza ghulam was a liar.
@ islambychoice
You raise some interesting points however there a number of flaws in your arguments.
You said: “if you ask them for proof, they give you stuff in urdu;”
I think your experience of Ahmadis is rather limited because not all Ahmadis in Britain read urdu so I think it’s a bit far fetched to think they all would point you to urdu sources, unless they are asking you to read the original writings of the Promised Messiah (as). And even if they do, that in no way implies a weakness in their argument. Now that suggestion by you is a fallacy if I’ve ever read one.
Also, you raise the objection “…people who are raised here are typically worse in following Islam themselves; relax on everything.”
Perhaps you have not met many Muslims of your own persuasion. You are suggesting that “typically”, Muslims born in this country are extremely strict in observing Islam, whereas from my experience of going to school, college and university with other Muslims, I found most of them stuck on the web of fornication…not very strict wouldn’t you say? If you consider observance of Islamic ritual only as strictly eating from halal restaurants and turning up for salat on Eid, then of course you are right. However if there are weak members amongst the Ahmadiyya Muslim community (and indeed there are), then I think it’s fair to say you will find many more weak members amongst your own local Muslim community. So that argument of yours doesn’t really prove anything either.
You have also stated that Ahmadi Muslims claim that “…Mullahs are aggressive…” You have completely disregarded the fact that I was personally threatened (that too in the UK). Let’s also not forget the near daily attacks on Ahmadis in various countries, most prominently in Pakistan where the “law” encourages discrimination and persecution of Ahmadi Muslims. These are not “virtual Mullahs”. They are very real to the families being torn apart through murders committed in the name of Islam. I don’t hear any condemnation of such acts from you! Just last month, a young guy was murdered in Karachi 3 days after his wedding, and only yesterday it was announced his father-in-law succumbed to the injuries from that same attack. Last year I also met a guy from Indonesia who suffered a machete attack only because he was an Ahmadi Muslim. Those scars on his head, hands and legs looked pretty real to me (May Allah have Mercy). This is very real, so please do not insult people’s intelligence through your dismissive and callous attitude. And you wonder why the West has such negative feelings for Muslims? Please be sensible.
I think you should also ask the Shia, Christians and Hindus of Pakistan if they have also met these (as you put it) “crazy indo/pak “Mullahs” ”. It’s not just Ahmadi Muslims having to face this hatred. Please, for the sake of justice at least admit that.
You have said that “Ahamdi’s throw themselves out of Islam when they have other Nabis beside the last messenger and Nabi.” Please provide evidence from the Qur’an – the final Sharia of God, that the criteria of being a Muslim is anything other than believing in Allah and Muhammad (saw) – as Ahmadi Muslims do. I’ve never been given an answer based on the Qur’an for this question.
I think the more important question you must ask yourself (assuming you believe as most Muslims do that Hadhrat Jesus (as) will return in the latter days in his physical form). Will Jesus (as) still be a Prophet of Allah on his return? I know for a fact that Allah has given him the title of both Nabi and Rasool in the unchangeable Qur’an…when he returns, do you intend to take away his titles or do you intend to change the Qur’an (God forbid)? Please ponder over that one and provide me some evidence that Jesus (as) will not be a Prophet. Again I’ve never had a straight answer on that one either.
In regards your comment on the “Fabricated hadith about the eclipse”…I think regardless of the chain, if a prophecy of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (saw) has been emphatically fulfilled (which in this case it has), whether or not it is a weak hadith, the hadith must be accepted, otherwise you are in danger of showing disrespect to the words of our master Prophet Muhammad (saw). Please ponder carefully and do not let your prejudices overtake your judgement.
Wassalam
Ibne Khalid
Ghulam Mirza claimed that not only was he a prophet he was also an embodiment of Jesus, the Prophet Muhammad ( Peace be upon him) ,Budha etc etc.Clearly Ghulam ( may God deal with him) has defiled the Shahadah. How can Muslims be so gullible as to be deceived by his teachings.
Here is what Imam Shaikh and NAMF objected to:
Muhammad (saw): The Astonishing Story of the Prophet (Free public event which was held on November 20th, 2012, Roy Thomson Hall, Toronto, Canada) and hosted by volunteers from the Ahmadiyya Muslim Jamaat
Here is what guests who came from a diverse range of backgrounds had to say about the event honoring the beautiful life of our beloved Holy Prophet, Muhammad (saw):
Instead of joining forces to help honor the life of the Holy Prophet (saw), Imam Shaikh boycotted the event and instead launched a unilateral debate campaign directed at Jamaat Ahmadiyya.
Reasonable minds will ask Imam Shaikh why he advised his followers against attending the event (especially in an open and free society) which was held solely for the purpose of honoring the life of The Holy Prophet (saw) of Islam and was well attended by a diverse range of people. Where was Imam Shaikh when Muslims (from different sects) and even non-Muslims attended the event to show their interest and support in the life of the Holy Prophet (saw) of Islam?
Look at what Mr. Farooq Khan from NAMF has publicly said (Imam Shaikh was present) about respecting other religious leaders/communities:
In his article (http://thedebateinitiative.com/2012/11/21/ahmediyya-and-muslims/) and by his actions, has Imam Shaikh lived up to these high standards given the language, tone and types of accusations he has raised towards another Islamic community?
The quadianis are scared to debate MGA’S character, upbringing, life and death. They don’t want others and specially their cult members to know anything about their cherished leader’s life. Otherwise MIRZA FAMILY’S CO-OPERATIVE BANK would start losing many of its clientele. Their cult members are fed specific diet they must follow. No exceptions allowed otherwise you face boycott. There is a calculator on quadiani UK website which calculates how much Chanda you must pay (based on your income) to MIRZA FAMILY’S CO-OPERATIVE BANK. And that is not sufficient. There are other 10s of Chanda’s through out the year. They don’t care if you don’t fulfill other religious obligations but you better pay Chanda or else. And if you don’t, even your family is asked to boycott you. Finally you are forced to write a sorry letter to their khalifa and your boycott continues till he forgives you. How many quadiani youths have read MGA books in Urdu? If one really wants to understand the mind of MGA, they should read his books in Urdu. Then you will appreciate why quadiani leadership avoids discussion on MGA’s life and character like a plague.
Office of Religious Rights & Freedom Launched by Prime Minister Stephen Harper
The Office of Religious Rights & Freedom was Officially Launched by The Prime Minister of Canada – Hon. Stephen Harper on February 19th 2013 at the newly built Aiwan-e-Tahir (Tahir Hall), a Community Centre by the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community in Canada.
Here is the embedded link for the announcement:
This article presents clear idea for the new viewers of blogging, that really how to do running a blog.
Dear Sir.im really horrified to know your views about Ahmadies. What ever you say and no matter how biased you are , the fact remains that Ahmadies are the only jamaa’at who has been preaching the true Islam here in he west for the past 100 years. The 1st Ahmadyya run Mosque here in the uk was 1914.the 1st Mosque build solely by Ahmadyya funds was in london uk in 1924.this was long before the Pakistanis started to come to work here in the uk…long live ve Ahmaddyyet the only true Islam….amin summa amin. ..
Muhammed ilyas uk
in April 1907, Mirza Ghulam qadiani issued an open letter addressed to
Maulvee Sanaaullaah. The imposter mirza wrote (partial translation);
“…. if, during my lifetime, you are not afflicted with such punishment such as plague,
cholera etc., then I am not from God Almighty.
O God, If this claim of being the Promised Messiah is just a fabrication from my self and, in your view, I am a mischief-monger and a liar and am engaged in making false imputations day and night then, O my beloved Master, I pray to You to make me perish in the lifetime of Mr. Maulvee Sanaaullaah and make him and his group happy by my death. Aameen. But O my Perfect and True God, if Maulvee Sanaaullaah is not true in the accusations that he levels at me, then I humbly pray to You to perish him in my lifetime.” [The Last Decision with Mr. Maulvee Sanaaullaah]
this supplication made by mirza has nothing to do with a comparison or a duel between Mirza Ghulam Ahmad and Maulvee Sanaaullaah; it has to do with whether or not
Mirza was a liar.
the letter also declares that if Maulvee Sanaaullaah is not afflicted with a fatal disease in Mirza Ghulam’s life then Mirza Ghulam qadiani is not from God.
the outcome; the cursed impsoter Mirza Ghulam qadiani died a disgraceful death deficating and vomiting after about one year from the date of the letter, in 1908. However Maulvee Sanaaullaah lived for many years after him.
No wonder The Quran states; “And say, “Truth has come, and falsehood has departed. Indeed is falsehood, [by nature], ever bound to depart.” [Quran 17:81]
To refute the qadiani’s bizarre explanation regarding this confrontation;
Events preceding the “Last Decision” open letter are irrelevant. This is because Mirza Ghulam qadiani prayed to God, in the “Last Decision” open letter published in 1907, that if his claim of being the Promised Messiah is false, he should die in the life time of Maulvee Sanaaullaah.
Mirza Ghulam qadiani died before Maulvee Sanaaullaah. So mirza according to his own letter failed and was proven as an imposter according to his own writings. The events before the letter are irrelevant.
In fact, if Mirza Ghulam qadiani had referred to the letter as a mubaahilah challenge, he would have been guilty of breach of promise. That is because in 1899 the apostate Mirza Ghulam qadiani had to sign a declaration, by judicial order, to refrain from using derogatory/vile language and from any prayer dual.
the imposter mirza ghulam qadiani alleged to see God as a human, he alleged that God has progeny, he alleged that qadian is mentioned in the Quran.
the dajjal mirza lied , he alleged “If the Holy Qur’an has not reffered to me as the Son of Mary, I am a liar”. Obviously mirza is not mentioned in the Quran at all and also qadiani is not mentioned in the Quran at all.
the qadiani sher aly gave a bizarre interpretation of surah ya sin by alleging that mirza is mentioned in surah ya sin.
anyways there is no such concept of a person being a re-incarnation of all prophets. this strange ideology was invented by the heretic mirza.
mirza also alleged that he is mentioned in the Quran [gift for nadwah page 16]. This is a lie !
mirza alleged to be second coming of Prophet Muhammad (SAW) and also mirza wrote poetry which contradicts the Quran;
“And We did not give Prophet Muhammad, knowledge of poetry, nor is it befitting for him. It is not but a message and a clear Qur’an” [Quran 36:69]
Ok reply some simple questions MGA sympathizers, if MGA (May Allah Pak deal with him) was really a prophet (NAuzbiAllah), then what about future of Prophet hood ??? What about the status of people claiming prophet hood before him like Beha Ullah, Muslema Kazzab & after him like Yousaf Kazzab ??? Where is the Golden Age of Muslims as promised after arrival of the promised Messiah ??? Before fabricating false propaganda about your false Messiah, 1st learn about him, what was his character, teachings & accusations he had leveled against his contemporary peers. So much for your so called ‘RELIGION OF TRUTH’.